Responses on Catholicism

4 Questions

This is some email correspondence about Catholicism. It begins with a letter from Ronnie, followed by my response to him, and then by a response from a former pastor.

From: Ronnie

I read you site on Catholicism and it stimulated some thinking. I am a life-long Catholic and I am very knowlegable about my faith. I think Catholics should not be ignorant of what they believe, but I do not think that Catholicism is anti-biblical. Please answer these questions for me.

1. The Catholic church put the New Testament together in 397 AD. It decided which of the hundreds of writings to put into the bible. If Catholicism is a false religion, why do protestants use our "false New Testament?" Why don't protestants put together their own bible?

2. How can millions of people claim that the holy spirit is interpreting the bible for them, yet there are over 25,000 different protestant denominations? Is more than one interpretation of the holy scriptures O.K.? Who is leading the people who are interpreting the bible incorrectly? How do you know if you are right or wrong?

3. If Christ built his visible church in the 1st century, did it disappear after a while and magically reappear during the reformation? Did everyone go to hell for a period of 1400 years when the Catholic church and the orthodox churches were the only Christians?

4. How do you know when you are saved? If you turn away from God, you can lose your salvation. I wouldn't boast about being so sure about heaven. Read what Paul wrote to the Philipians in chapter 2 verses 12-18. Fear and trembling does not sound very reassuring, does it?

Ronnie Mayeux

From: Dana

Before going by number, let me note that Christianity is based on the scriptures, and a believer's life should be led by the Holy Spirit in accordance with the scriptures.

That's a lot like the argument about Peter, the first Catholic pope I suppose. In reality, Catholicism adopted Peter, just as it adopted the New Testament scriptures. As I remember it, the early church fathers that supported much of what we have in the New Testament were not Catholic per se, and I believe it was much earlier than the formation of the Roman church.

I also suspect that the Roman church had not yet been corrupted by the introduction of pagan beliefs that are now a part of Catholicism and it's holy days.

I am also reminded that Catholicism attempts to trace its origins historically (oral tradition) rather that prove its compliance with the holy scriptures.

Actually, protestantism doesn't have the same Bible. We have the Jewish scriptures and the New Testament. Catholicism adds the Apocrypha to the Jewish scriptures.

Simple. The Bible and the Holy Spirit must agree. Though it's not necessary to make the point, you might try doing some research about those 25,000 denominations, or at least the major ones. You'll find that much of their basic beliefs are very similar. One of those similarities being that they "protest" the Catholic church.

This is another false presumption. With the sanction of the state, Roman Catholicism was the predominate faith, but I've read of other believers during that period that were not a part of the Catholic church. I think there's always been a remnant of believers, just as there has been a remnant in Israel that hold to their faith.

It is worth noting that Christians are not "sanctioned" by a church, nor is their faith necessarily passed down. Salvation and the birth of a new believer is only dependent on God, and the believer's faith in Jesus. God can make a new believer, and begin a new church at any time, in any place.

You seem to have stopped at verse 12.

13. For it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure.

I'm assured. The whole book of Galatians is written to point out that our salvation is a result of our faith in Jesus, not in the works of the Jewish law. You will remember that that Jewish law was the perfect law, as laws go. As believers we are not under the old law, but under the law of the Spirit. How are we under the law of the Spirit? We are born of the Spirit? (John 3) We are new creatures in Christ.

I've read most of the stock answers for Catholicism's basic beliefs. Unfortunately, they aren't things you can deduce FROM scripture. Instead, Catholicism USES scriptures to give excuses for their beliefs. Biblically, Peter (the small stone), for example, was never made head of the church. Jesus is, and will always be.

The church in Catholicism is distorted. Instead of an institution, to which the members are "subject" to, the new testament church is a body, where members function much like members of a physical body.

I could go on, (and I'm certainly no specialist in Catholicism), but I'll try to make this my last point. In most churches, Catholics enter the sanctuary and bow down to statues of Jesus and Mary, etc. What did God say about bowing down to "graven images?"

From: George

I can see that you realize that many Catholics (as well as many Protestants) are ignorant of what they believe. Yet Jesus said Matthew 4:4 "Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God."

I'll try to answer your questions.

Question No.1

First let me start by saying that the Roman Catholic Church didn't exist in 397 A.D. It was the Christian Church. Not the denomination that uses that name, but believers who believed that Jesus was the Christ, the Son of God, and that he died for the sins of the world.

As the number of believers in Christ increased, doctrinal error and immorality crept into the church. These errors were corrected by the teaching and writings of the apostles.

To combat error and direct the church, more and more authority was exercised by church leaders. Some of this authority exceeded what is authorized by the Scriptures, hence, an ecclesiastical hierarchy developed. This hierarchy became the Roman Catholic Church as it is known today.

The Catholic New Testament is very similar to that used by the Protestants. The problem between the Catholic and Protestant Bibles comes in the Old Testament with the addition of the apocrypha in the Catholic Bible.

You can read in your Catholic Bible that in Paul's letter to the Romans 3:1-2 we read that one of the advantages the Jews had over the gentiles was that to the Jews God entrusted the "oracles of God" (another word for the Old Testament Scriptures). The books accepted by the Jews as the inspired Word of God are the same ones found inl the protestant Old Testament. The Jews in the time of Christ didn't accept the Apocrypha as inspired and neither do the Protestants. So you can see that the Jews were the guardians of the Old Testament and not the Catholic Church.

Question No. 2

It isn't a question of Catholic vs Protestant interpretation, the question should be "How should anyone interpret the Bible?"

Since the Holy Spirit inspired the writing of Scripture (2 Peter 1:20-21), and used human writers, we should expect that the Scriptures should be interpreted in a literal, historical, and grammatical way ( using the original languages of Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek) unless a figure of speech is used. This science is know as hermeneutics. Laziness, ignorance and a preconceived idea of what one wants the Scriptures to say cause most of the errors in interpretation.

Most of the Evangelical Protestant denominations agree with the basic doctrines such as the existence of God, the deity of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, the virgin birth of Christ, Christ's death in complete payment for our sins, His resurrection and a future judgment for sin, and the eternal state of the wicked and the just.

The application of the truth of Scriptures to our lives is another matter. In John 16:13-15, Jesus told his disciples that when the Holy Spirit is come (which happened on the Day of Pentecost according to Acts 2d) He would guide the disciples into truth (John 16:12-14). It is interesting to note that the Holy Spirit would glorify Christ and not the Holy Spirit himself.

In 1 Corinthians 2:12, the Scriptures state that believers have the Holy Spirit within (See also, Romans 8:9) so that we might understand spiritual truth. Verse 13 says that the Spirit's teaching would not contradict other Scripture. Verse 14, that the unbeliever, here called the "natural man", cannot understand spiritual truth. In 3:1-4, it says that the carnal Christian (the one who lives for the things and pleasures of this world ) can only understand the simple things of Scripture which here are called ":milk".

You asked how one could know if his interpretation is right or wrong. The answer I would suggest is to seek the natural, grammatical meaning in accordance with the context (this is what we should do with any writing or speech). The interpretation must be in harmony with other Scripture since God does not contradict himself. The reader's attitude must be a willingness to believe and obey God's Word and to glorify and honor Christ with his life.

Doesn't this explain why many Catholics and Protestants aren't interested in serious Bible study and many (either Catholics or Protestants) are mistaken in their interpretation?

question no.3

CHRIST'S VISIBLE CHURCH

Your question is really concerning Catholic-Protestant controversy. Shouldn't it be "What does the Bible say about the church?"

First, note a few clear Bible declarations:

1. John's 1st general epistle 5:12. "He that has the Son has life (eternal, v. 11), he that has not the Son of God has not life (eternal v.121)."

Therefore, the determining factor as to who has eternal life is whether a person HAS the Son, not with what church he is affiliated.

2. John's Gospel 5:24 "He who hears my word and believes on him who sent me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death unto life."

Thus, in order to have everlasting life it is necessary to hear (in the sense of receiving) Christ's word, and believe in the Father who sent him.

Next, let's consider who is a member of Christ's universal or spiritual church.

1. Acts 2:14-47. Here we notice that as Peter preached to the Jews, many repented of what their nation's leaders had done in crucifying Jesus Christ. Verse 41 says that those who gladly received (believed) his word were baptized.
Verse 42 - these continued in the apostles doctrine, etc.
Verse 44 calls them believers (in Christ)
Verse 47 these believers were added to the Church.

2. Ephesians 1:22-23 refers to the church as Christ's body.

3. 1 Corinthians 1:12-13 teaches that we (who are believers in Christ) are all baptized or joined to Christ's body by the Holy Spirit.

Summary.
The believers (apostles and other disciples) wer3e baptized (joined) by the Spirit into the body of Christ on the Day of Pentecost Acts 1:5; 2:1-4.

Since then, people are baptized by the Spirit into the universal spiritual church when they believe (Acts 10:44) and after are should be baptized by water (Acts 10:47-48).

Now concerning the visible church, there are people who profess to believe in Christ and his death for their sins whose live demonstrate the opposite. No one is saved or lost by being a Catholic or Protestant, but by believing or not in Christ.

The visible church (Catholic or Protestant) would probably have both saved (those who are trusting in Christ's death for their salvation) and unsaved. Only God can see the heart.

Some of the unsaved would be those who are trusting a doctrine or an organization instead of the Person and work of Christ. Others pretend to be Christians to win a girl's hand in marriage or to get a contract from other Christians who attend. Some hope by attending church their good works will outweigh and cancel out their sins (instead of trusting Christ's death for forgiveness (Ephesians 1:7).